cadet logbooks

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kyo224
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cadet logbooks

Postby kyo224 » Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:16 pm

hi this is my first post and i just want to rant alittle about cadet logbooks
i live in st. john's nl and i recently graduated from mi but waiting on transport canada to correct my logbooks so i can write my 4th class...now before i can pass them into tc they have to be corrected by the school first which takes awhile because they only have one guy who corrects all the books for the marine engineering students...so once he finally signs it off you have to get tc examiner to look over the book..i have been waiting now 6weeks for my books at tc to be corrected....with more corrections to come before they will sign it off...this to me just seems to be overkill..

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The Dieselduck
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby The Dieselduck » Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:06 am

I think you are meeting for the first time the bureaucracy of Transport Canada and its inability to provide Canada's seafarers with a product of consistent quality. Unfortunately, your type of experience is not uncommon. The duplicity and redundancy of mundane items is enough to drive anyone batty.

My license is being renewed, it expires in September, this is how I feed my family, it took me three times to go into the office to get the paperwork in order and approved to send of to Ottawa to be further approved for issue; and my licensed was valid and current, this is just a renewal, nothing special.

Five months now, and still no new license. The long wait is no stranger to TC clients; medicals routinely exceed 6 months before getting your official one from Ottawa.

Hard not to be cynical....
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JK
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby JK » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:58 am

When I read the original post, I immediately thought, yep, St John's. There is the country, then there is St John's.

Yes the ticket issue is painful, isn't it Martin? Add to it, wading through the TPs trying to figure out what you are suppose to be doing. Actually I didn't wade, I emailed a friend..

Try docking a boat in another region with different inspection standards, it will send you gibbering into the corner with rage, especially when the surveyor will not call you back with the info you need.And it is different inspection standards, do not doubt that. Amazing how black and white can be interpreted.

kyo224
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby kyo224 » Wed Jul 20, 2011 6:52 pm

yeah its very frustrating!!! to spend 4 years in school dealing with all their shit..just to get out and have to deal with with a whole different pile...but then again tc tells the schools what has to be done with regards to courses and training.... so i dunno...just pisses me off....anyways after many calls to the tc the past week or so im really hoping by next week the books with be ready for some corrections....

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JollyJack
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby JollyJack » Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:52 am

tut tut, such vitriol. The Cadet programme is governed by TP 8911 which can be accessed here: http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/marinesafety/tp ... u-1448.htm

TRB requirements are covered in the TP, section 3.1 (2), which says, in part:

"As the Skills Training and Training Record Book requirements are included in the cadet program, candidates applying for marine engineering certificates will not be required to show separate training certificates for either of these two requirements."


The College sights and marks their Training Record Books as part of the course, the Graduation Certificate generally exempts the cadet from TRB and PSME requirements for STCW. However, an audit of Memorial revealed some inconsistencies and now TC sights the Record books from there to ensure that it's all good.

Certificate renewal is covered in the Marine Personnel regulations, section 107 for Engineers.

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regu ... age-5.html

If you have 3 months sea time in the past 12 months, or 12 months in the past 5 years, and a valid Seafarer's Medical, you're good to go. Other qualifying service, as Superintendant, etc, is covered in 107 (3)(c)

The delay in vetting, verifying and issuing Certificates is caused by a shortage of staff and work overload in Ottawa. The same 3 guys do the whole country's Certificates, all the course audits, all the School approvals, all the direct entry candidates from foreign administrations.........they're kept pretty busy. Be patient, they'll get there.
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kyo224
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby kyo224 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:41 pm

books are signed off :)....now its time to study!

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JollyJack
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby JollyJack » Wed Jul 27, 2011 3:51 am

Study for 4th Class? Your time at MI and associated sea service should give you knowledge sufficient to challenge 4th Class EKG. The programme is designed so that a Graduate should have no problems passing 4th Class, there's enough sea service and other Qualifying service for it. (36 months, which must include 6 months at sea on a vessel of 500Kw or more). EGK is on Monday at 1300 every week, and it costs $27:50. TC Offices are closed next Monday, it's a holiday, but you can probably arrange to do EK(Motor) on Tuesday morning at the scheduled time, and EKG in the afternoon. (unless you're challenging EK Steam) Written Exams (or in this case, multiple guess) cost $27:50 each and the Oral costs $55.

The exams are marked by placing a template over the dots and if they all line up (or at least 60% of them do) you'll know instantly if you've passed.

Here's the schedule from TP 2293, section 4.4 table VIII

Fourth-class Morning Afternoon
Monday General engineering knowledge
Tuesday Engineering knowledge of motor ships Engineering knowledge of steamships

You probably have all 2nd Class Part A theory exams done and at least one of 1st Class Part A, you're on your way! Just get some sea time in and get your knees brown. (Go deep sea.)
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kyo224
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby kyo224 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:32 am

yeah over the 4years you tend to forget stuff..so i'm just going to brush up on afew things
went down to tc this morning to book my general exam and now you must give 5 days notice to write an exam....So, you can't write 2 exams in the same week and they only do engineering exams very 2nd week...this process now will take me over a month

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JollyJack
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby JollyJack » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:13 am

Must be St Johns thing, Exams are scheduled by Ottawa every week to be administered in every TC across Canada at the same time (allowing for time differences) The Schedules are in TP2293, section 4.4

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/marinesafety/tp ... -154.htm#4

Engineering Exams are in Table VIII

Section 1.5 (1) of TP 2293 says:

1.5 Application for examination

1) Under section 110 of the Marine Personnel Regulations, the examiner may postpone the examination an applicant seeks to take if the applicant does not provide the examiner with an application and the required documentation at least two weeks before the date set for the examination.

("The Examiner MAY postpone"........However, a day or so is usually sufficient to get the Exam ready (it's not rocket science). Likewise, there is nothing to prevent you writing several Exams in the same week, if you are eligible to do so.)

That said, the Marine Personnel Regulations, section 110 (2) referenced above says:

(2) An applicant shall provide the following to the examiner, at least two weeks before the first of the examinations referred to in these Regulations that the applicant seeks to take:

(a) a signed application containing the information and declarations set out in Schedule 2 to this Part;

(b) the applicant’s birth certificate or equivalent;

(c) all of the discharge books and any certificates of discharge in respect of the qualifying service required for the certificate or endorsement sought;

(d) any testimonials, containing the required signatures and at least the information set out in Schedule 4 or 5 to this Part, as the case may be, in respect of the sea service required for the certificate or endorsement sought; and

(e) any pertinent certificate held by the applicant, including certificates issued by an Administration, other than the Minister, recognized by the IMO as being compliant with the STCW Convention.



4.1(1) of TP 2293 says:

Applicants must make arrangement with the examiner and present themselves at the examination center according to the scheduled time and date of the examination. An applicant who does not appear for examination at the appointed time will forfeit the examination fee.

1st July 2007 saw the Canada Shipping Act 2001, and the Marine Personnel Regulations come into force.....and things changed drastically! Now, some parts of Canada have to catch up to 2007......

Got problems? Try a different TC office and a different Examiner. Here is a list of all TC offices in Canada, from TP 2293, section 1.8

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/marinesafety/tp ... 2145.htm#8

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
800 Burrard Street, suite 810
Vancouver, BC V6Z 2J8
Tel.: 604-666-0834
Fax: 604-666-9177

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
501-1230 Government Street
Victoria, BC V8W 1Y3
Tel.: 250-363-0394
Fax: 250-363-0330

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
60 Front Street
Room 208, Federal Building
Nanaimo, BC
V9R 5H7
Tel.: 250-754-0244
Fax: 250-754-0245

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
400-309 2nd Ave. West
Prince Rupert, BC V8J 3T1
Tel.: 250-627-3045
Fax: 250-624-9305

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
Prairie & Northern Region
344 Edmonton St.
Winnipeg, MA R3P 0P6
Tel.: 204-983-7498
Fax: 204-984-8417

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
Canada Place, 11th Floor
1100-9700 Jasper Avenue
Edmonton, AB T5J 4E6
Tel.: 780-495-4023
Fax: 780-495-6472

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
100 Front St. South
Sarnia, ON N7T 2M4
Tel.: 519-383-1826
Fax: 519-383-1997

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
31 Hyperion Court, 2nd Floor
Kingston, ON K7K 7G3
Tel.: 613-545-8676
Fax: 613-545-8714

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
Landmark Building
43 Church Street, 7th Floor
St. Catharines, ON L2R 7E1
Tel.: 905-688-4360
Fax: 905-688-6285

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P. O. Box 247
44 Hurontario Street, 2nd. Floor
Collingwood, ON L9Y 3Z5
Tel.: 705-445-3320
Fax: 705-445-9531

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
103-33 S. Court Street
Thunder Bay, ON P7B 2W6
Tel.: 807-345-6953
Fax: 807-345-0521

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
4900 Yong Street, 4th Floor
North York, ON M2N 6A5
Tel.: 416-952-1018
Fax: 416-973-8133

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
901 Cap Diamant, 4th Floor
Quebec, QC G1K 4K1
Tel.: 418-648-3234
Fax: 418-648-5106

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
800 West René Lévesque Blvd Suite 620
Montréal, QC H3B 1X9
Tel.: 514-283-7056
Fax: 514-283-6595

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
180 de la Cathédrale Street
Rimouski, QC G5L 5H9
Tel.: 418-722-3040
Fax: 418-722-3332

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 1013
45 Alderney Drive Queen Square, 14th Floor
Dartmouth, NS B2Y 4K2
Tel.: 902-426-9321
Fax: 902-426-6657

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
Federal Arts Building, 2nd. Floor
196 George Street
Sydney, NS B1P 1J3
Tel.: 902-564-7002
Fax: 902-564-7648

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 850
248 Pleasant Street
Yarmouth, NS B5A 4K5
Tel.: 902-742-6860
Fax: 902-742-6866

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
811 Reeves Street, Unit 1
Shediac Plaza,
Port Hawkesbury, NS B9A 2S4
Tel.: 902-625-0803
Fax: 902-625-1722

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
97 Queen Street, 2nd Floor,
Dominion Building Box 1270
Charlottetown, PEI C1A 7M8
Tel.: 902-566-7987
Fax: 902-566-7991

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
189 Prince William Street, 1st Floor
Saint John, NB E2L 2B9
Tel.: 506-636-4748
Fax: 506-636-4756

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 1207
275 Main Street, 5th Floor
Bathurst, NB E2A 4J1
Tel.: 506-548-7491
Fax: 506-548-7180

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 1300
10 Barter`s Hill, 9th Floor
Cabot Bldng, Tower 2
St. John’s, NL A1C 6H8
Tel.: 709-772-5166
Fax: 709-772-0210

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 1143
E.K. Jerret Building
Marystown, NL A0E 2M0
Tel.: 709-279-2201
Fax: 709-279-1188

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
Herald Towers
P.O. Box 22
Corner Brook, NL A2H 6C3
Tel.: 709-637-4390
Fax: 709-637-4391

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
P.O. Box 237
122 Main Street Chipman Complex
Lewisporte, NL AOG 3AO
Tel.: 709-535-2503
Fax: 709-535-8297

Marine Safety
Transport Canada
C.P. 596 701, Boul. Laure, Suite 205
Sept-Îles (Québec) G4R 4K7
Tel.: (418) 968-4991
Fax: (418) 968-5516
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kyo224
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby kyo224 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 4:15 pm

Thanks for all the great info....i actually traveled over to Sidney N.S and wrote the exams in 2 days :)
now the job hunt begins....

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JollyJack
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Re: cadet logbooks

Postby JollyJack » Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:29 pm

have a look at the job postings on here.
Discourage incest, ban country "music".


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