Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

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Jameseze24
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Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Jameseze24 »

Hi guys, probably someone has more experience on windlass motor here, please can you explain possibly reason for the windlass not taking anchor load.

I understand maybe there's an oil bypass somewhere, though the hydraulic motor was overhauled by some workshop in UAE, but what happened inside the motor is what I don't know. Could the bypass from motor or the lever block safety valves? If motor, what is your recommendation.
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

What type of Windlass?
Got any psi / flowrate oil gauge kits/adapters onboard?
Know your psi / flowrates readings and at what test points?
Done the basics?
Filters etc?
Correct hydraulic oil grade?
What make/model?
How do you get the hook up?
Chainblocks/liftpulls?
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Jameseze24
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Jameseze24 »

Thanks for your reply, the flow rate 50 to 250 bar, and when operating, I'm getting 250 bar. Filters already changed, O-rings on the lever block as well. Chain lock type.
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

Pressures?
Motor running the hydraulic pump turning at correct rpm under load?
Been through it all from the pump discharge to the tank return?
Suction pump pipe clear completely in the hydraulic tank?
Strum filter on stackpipe?
Any bypass / one way valves playing up?
Brakebind?
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

We got a temp. gauge on our test kit.
Very important as any overtemperaturing normally means restriction in the line/valves etc.
Blockages in other words.
T'S P'S and flowrates tests.
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Atlantic
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Atlantic »

Is there any plugs to air it out? Check the manual for procedure to air it out. Check the relief valves on your control block if any? Is the brake releasing proper?

Good luck and regards

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The Dieselduck
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by The Dieselduck »

Like Merlyn says, having a test kit for pressure is of paramount importance. If you are lucky enough to have the right fittings at the right place and finding out what your hydraulics is actually doing at various points in the system, is key. I had a similar problem on a dredge with a rather extensive hydraulic system. Before my time, the ship had a failure of the hyd cooling system, which contaminated the hydraulic oil with seawater and dirt, and led to numerous, serious issues over time. It was quite interesting to troubleshoot and learn, as it is normally a system which does not require a great deal of attention once operational. I was always a little nervous to start pulling things here and there to troubleshoot.

One of the things that i found invaluable was the testing kit, and some radios. In my case, like merlyn said, i could tell my system was leaking by, due to hot pipes. As a result, that meant that the winch simply did not have enough oooomph to haul the anchor (not much to do with the actual motor), due to a lack of pressure and volume, since the system relief valve was dumping. The contamination had eroded the seat, and was dumping pressure, back into the header tank, not a tremendous amount, but enough.

Another thing i learned was - "its a system"! The focus might be on a particular function, but the actual cause can be far removed from that component. This of course means extensive troubleshooting, but also brings satisfaction that you will now know the system pretty damn well.

The cooling failure was a very costly failure for that vessel - a design failure really - putting any raw water cooling system on a dredge is a really stupid idea - i bet it is still causing a great deal of headaches on such a complex hydraulic system. Part of the problem was also the use of EAL oils, (environmentally acceptable lubricants) which absorb a certain amount of contamination, making it very dificult to troubleshoot from a maintenance perspective. I certainly will think twice about putting a seawater cooling on hydraulic system which depends on finely machine parts. Once that contamination is in there, it is practically impossible to remove. Water and dirt were everywhere, and as such, created a great deal of problems.

Let us know how you make out...
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JK
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by JK »

We trialed EAL oils on a relatively simple system on a smaller vessel. What a nightmare that became. I can't remember the sequence now because it's been a few years and I wasn't directly involved, but there was safety relief issues, localized overheating of the oil, breakdown of the oil, more overheating, strainer/filter issues which actually caused the canister being crushed with the pump suction. The system was not performing at all at the end. There had to be a complete system cleaning. One of the jr engineers brought in one of the crushed canisters in a sealed 5 gallon can to show us. He went back to sea, and the can was forgotten under a desk until this noxious odor permeated the office. :shock:
So yes,I'm agreeing with DD.

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D Winsor
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by D Winsor »

It's possible that the problem is not with the hydraulic system at all. The problem could be in the torque limiting coupling, if fitted between the drive motor and the windlass gearbox.
I've experienced issues with the torque limiting coupling on electric motor driven windlasses that would slip prematurely preventing the windlass from developing the torque required to lift the anchor.
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Jameseze24
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Jameseze24 »

Thanks to all of you.. after proper troubleshooting, I found a piece of metal on the motor relief valve .. which kept the valve wide open... Bypassing oil from from winch motor to the return line. That was removed, pressure adjusted as required and now working perfectly.
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

Brill, the valve did'nt help you out perchance by playing you a tune then?
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Jameseze24
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Jameseze24 »

@Merlyn I won't by any chance guess the valve had any problems... Same valve was renewed at dry dock resently during overhauling of the windlass... Actually we are still diagnosing where the metal came from.... Filters checked nothing was found.
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

Got any magnetic drain plugs in the system anywhere?
Or is the foreign body non magnetic?
Brass phosphor bronze etc?
Or was it introduced into the system when it was stripped?
No seat damage then?
Remembering The Good Old days, when Chiefs stood watches and all Torque settings were F.T.

Jameseze24
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Jameseze24 »

Magnet on the filter side yes.. it wasn't Brass phosphor bronze... Something like cast aluminium...no seat damage
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Merlyn
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Re: Windlass not taking load on my ship, ideas to fix it

Post by Merlyn »

Cast Ally eh?
Casing?
Any inspection hatches over gearing etc?
Any peep holes for a gander inside?
Maybe something ( chip off gear ) took a lump outa casing?
Could be further probs. lurking?
Maybe something got trapped between gears/casings and took a lump out.
Remembering The Good Old days, when Chiefs stood watches and all Torque settings were F.T.

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