Plate cooler

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D Winsor
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby D Winsor » Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:58 am

The raw Water System you have described seems to be familiar to me so before adding plates to the cooler it is suggested that you check the following especially if the jacket water cooling water regulator is a 3 way ported type valve with some sort of actuator that sets the valve to bypass the cooler at lower temperatures.
Check the condition and function of the valve to insure you are getting the maximum amount of jacket water passing through the cooler. If the valve is out of position, the actuator is not properly set up to work in the correct range of travel or if valve ports are eroded away jacket water will bypass the cooler causing overheating when the sea water is the warmest.
Check to make sure you don't have a small compression gas leak into the cooling system from one of the auxiliary engines from a leaking head or cracked liner. Under the right conditions this too could cause overheating at high loads that could otherwise be undetected in colder sea water
Troubleshooting 101 "Don't over think it - K.I.S.S. it"

astat101
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby astat101 » Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:20 am

Hi, I have been reading through the posts associated with this and maybe Vestas aircoil can advise. They design and manufacture charge air coolers for large diesel engines.

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Big Pete
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Big Pete » Fri Sep 18, 2015 2:22 am

I see this topic has just re surfaced and re reading it, I had another thought, very basic.

Most ships have 2 Sea Water pumps for each system, each rated to provide 100% cooling.

Some have 2 big pumps rated for 100% Sea Load cooling, plus a smaller Harbour cooling pump.

Others have 3 equal sized pumps, with one sufficient for Harbour cooling and TWO required to take the Full Sea Load.

I have joined a ship where the Engineers claimed not to be able to run the engine full ahead because of cooling problems and found that it was a 3 pump system but they were only running one pump, in Port and at Sea! They just thought they had two spare pumps.

Always worth checking the basics.

BP
It is always better to ask a stupid question than to do a stupid thing.

astat101
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby astat101 » Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:39 am

Hi,

I work for a company called Vestas aircoil who manufacture and design charge air coolers. I would be happy to answer questions if I can help.

studier
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby studier » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:02 pm

Have seen this done on two different vessels that left the north atlantic for work in the tropics. This worked on both occasions i believe it was appox 10% more plates we increased on both vessels.

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JollyJack
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby JollyJack » Fri Oct 23, 2015 8:23 pm

Yep, I believe that. NA temps vary between 2 and 7 °C, tropical, eg Perisian Gulf, are more like 30° C, You'd defo need more plates
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mradicone
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby mradicone » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:18 pm

Hi
Would you be interested in a method we used on Navy and cruise ships that keep exchangers clean?
Thanks
Mike

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Big Pete
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Big Pete » Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:26 am

The British Royal Navy are having similar problems on their new Daring Class Destroyers, cost a Billion pounds each, but the Bean Counters tried to save pennies and the cooling system is only good in the North Sea/Atlantic, they are all Electric with Diesel and Gas Turbine Generators, but they keep Blacking out when they go anywhere warm.
I can't make sense of the press reports because they are so determinedly non technical. But talk of installing extra Diesel Generators and uprating the cooling system.
Big Pete
It is always better to ask a stupid question than to do a stupid thing.

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Merlyn
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Merlyn » Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:45 am

B P
Have a read of Project Napier in " The Royal Institute Of Naval Architecture , it goes into it in great depth, it's very different to past gas turbine installations, interesting stuff especially with your knowledge of DE sets and the similar.
Seems all six type 45 S are laid up with all sorts of bullshit flying around from our politicians about crew needing leave etc etc etc.
It's a major, major cockup all round see one had to be towed into Canada for turbine repairs way back.
It's interesting reading concerning in the main air inlet intercooler failureswith UK government blaming RR and RR blaming U.K. Government.Also after cooling problems.
Yours and mine tax bill increases next year should cover it all so fret ye not.
Set ups very different to previous gas turbine set ups, interesting good true read.
Too bad it doesn't work.
Best you sell your RR shares pronto.
Remembering The Good Old days, when Chiefs stood watches and all Torque settings were F.T.

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Big Pete
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Big Pete » Fri Dec 30, 2016 1:24 am

Warships are normally built with so much redundancy that Blackouts, yet alone total loss of propulsion should be impossible, unless the ship suffers multiple Bomb/ Missile hits, way beyond DP III.
I will have to log in to RINA to read the article, it sounds fascinating.
I saw more sense about the problems in the Business / Financial pages of the Newspapers than in the General News, and nothing much in the Institute of Marine Engineers magazine.
Rolls Royce shares have tanked because they are heavily involved in the Offshore sector which is totally dead at present and they have had problems with one of their Aero Engines,, as well as the problems with the Darings.
Shame about the Darings, there Air Warfare capability is supposed toi be ahead of the Aegis types in the USN, unfortunatly the Bean Counters scrapped the anti ship missiles they were supposed to have and now propulsion problems....
Makes me weep for the sad shadow of its former self that the RN has become.

Big Pete
It is always better to ask a stupid question than to do a stupid thing.

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Merlyn
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Merlyn » Fri Dec 30, 2016 1:52 am

I'm looking right now at RFA's " parked up " with no place to go, no one to re arm or re fuel.
Have friends on them and it's pretty boring life going from one UK port to the other, sometimes for months at a time laid alongside.
RR's insurance excess must be millions what with the purchase of Mermaid Pods and the many bearing failures and the oilfeed
loss on the aircraft turbine causing a total loss engine situation plus now these six no goers type 45 'S laid up to argue about.
They say Billions of pounds at stake here, but from who?
Hope some foreign power doesn't decide to lob a shell our way over the festive period, only got those party poppers left over from the Xmas bash to fire back.
Putting all the gloom aside have a good one everyone!
Remembering The Good Old days, when Chiefs stood watches and all Torque settings were F.T.

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D Winsor
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby D Winsor » Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:56 am

I did a quick look at the type 45 Destroyers and did some more reading on problems with the ships.
Considering the Royal Canadian Navy is intending to decommission sometime in the near future the last of their "Tribal Class" destroyers that were commissioned when our current Prime Minister's father was Prime Minister. I hope that if and when the RN decides to cut their losses on these vessels and put a "For Sale" sign on them that the RCN doesn't see it.
Troubleshooting 101 "Don't over think it - K.I.S.S. it"

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JK
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby JK » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:08 am

Now,now. I was told/read somewhere that we actually didn't buy the subs, that the yanks did. With the N.Korean diesel elec subs, they needed something that they could practice with in detection. Since the subs have had so many Canadianizing issues, the yanks have not detected them whatsoever and have declared the concept a success.

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Merlyn
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby Merlyn » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:32 am

Well I read the Upholder / Victoria four subs were sold to the RCN and were big trouble from the one that had a faulty inner conning tower hatch which when it a bit roughers on the delivery trip the self drain mechanisms failed and when the inner hatch was opened 500 tons of water were dumped into the control room.
A major electrical fire ensued crippling the ship, killing one crew member and seriously injuring several others.
Ship had to be recovered to Canada.
When they were new they were incapable of firing torpedos owing to major design faults.
Mothballed ( and incorrectly apparently ) for years laid up before eventually being sold.
Your folks over there spent many many years trying to sort them out and one ( Winsor ) is used as a training ship only. ( nearly Dave )
Many, many problems still ongoing apparently and if the Yanks couldn't Sonar them it's not really surprising as it seems they have spent many years alongside, drydock or on the slip.
So unless your folk want to buy work I doubt they be keen to repeat the exercise with the next load of junk namely the type45's
Our civil servants over here actually get knighted for major cockups, should have gone into the civil service methinks and then I would be a first on the site, Sir Merlyn.
Remembering The Good Old days, when Chiefs stood watches and all Torque settings were F.T.

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D Winsor
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Re: Plate cooler

Postby D Winsor » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:32 am

Your folks over there spent many many years trying to sort them out and one ( Winsor ) is used as a training ship only. ( nearly Dave )


Now you know the secret why the "D" was dropped from our family name :lol: :lol:

Merlyn I guess your invitation to Buckingham Palace must have got lost in the mail
Troubleshooting 101 "Don't over think it - K.I.S.S. it"


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