STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

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Revolver
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby Revolver » Fri May 19, 2017 5:05 pm

Not if you did a 3/4 year cadet program that started after 2008?

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JollyJack
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby JollyJack » Wed May 24, 2017 3:22 pm

Word from Ottawa is that 2nd Class is considered "Management level" for the purposes of STCW Certification, so yes, we did waste time effort and money doing 1st Class.
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Revolver
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby Revolver » Wed May 24, 2017 6:43 pm

Yeah, I finally read the thing carefully.
And while the new MPRs and TP8911 aren't written yet, I've got a good idea of what is going to be required and what's going to happen.
Once they're finalized and approved, that's when it'll all be in force - yes.
You're estimating spring 2018-ish? And until then we're following the old MPRs.

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D Winsor
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby D Winsor » Thu May 25, 2017 11:41 am

JollyJack wrote:Word from Ottawa is that 2nd Class is considered "Management level" for the purposes of STCW Certification, so yes, we did waste time effort and money doing 1st Class.


You're probably right but even still I think,(and I've been known to be wrong in my interpretation or misinterpretation of regs) the new equivalent of a 1st class certificate will still be required on vessels over certain Propulsion KW rating threshold. 7000Kw for the Great Lakes or 3500Kw for International and Solas Coastal class vessels under the existing rules and I believe may be even lower under the new rules.

So unless companies suddenly apply to have the Propulsion Kw rating of their ships de-rated below the new threshold there will still be a requirement for 1st. Class Certificates but who will be left to fill the positions.

My biggest concern is with the dwindleing number of Canadian 1st class certificates, and an over abundance of equivalent certificates world wide. Combine this with an increasing level of difficulty to obtain the proper certified training courses required to obtain in general a certificate of any rating, here in Canada, that works against someone wanting to upgrade a certificate. Especially for those who didn't go through any sort of Cadet Program or chose to delay upgrading their certificates. Creating a perfect recipe for Shipping Companies to apply to the government to allow Foreign STCW 2010 Certified Crews to fill vacant positions.
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Sea Rover
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby Sea Rover » Thu May 25, 2017 1:56 pm

The dwindling number of First Class Licenses doesn't matter anymore.

Any Kid who started a Cadet Program in 2009, and graduated in 2013 (for example) and has 36 months of sea time as 4th, 3rd and or 2nd (you don't have to go through the ranks any more) is entitled to the highest license there is. They don't even have to do any TC exams other than 4th's (if they still do 4th's exams)

First Class Tickets have no more value

Soon every Engineer on board will all have the same ticket. When the Chief fucks up or refuses to sail the vessel, because it's unsafe or something, will be immediately sacked and everyone else will move up.

Being a Marine Engineer is no longer a profession, there are no more ranks. It's a complete waste of time dead end loser job. One day your fixing a toilet and the next your the man in charge.


D Winsor wrote:
JollyJack wrote:Word from Ottawa is that 2nd Class is considered "Management level" for the purposes of STCW Certification, so yes, we did waste time effort and money doing 1st Class.


You're probably right but even still I think,(and I've been known to be wrong in my interpretation or misinterpretation of regs) the new equivalent of a 1st class certificate will still be required on vessels over certain Propulsion KW rating threshold. 7000Kw for the Great Lakes or 3500Kw for International and Solas Coastal class vessels under the existing rules and I believe may be even lower under the new rules.

So unless companies suddenly apply to have the Propulsion Kw rating of their ships de-rated below the new threshold there will still be a requirement for 1st. Class Certificates but who will be left to fill the positions.

My biggest concern is with the dwindleing number of Canadian 1st class certificates, and an over abundance of equivalent certificates world wide. Combine this with an increasing level of difficulty to obtain the proper certified training courses required to obtain in general a certificate of any rating, here in Canada, that works against someone wanting to upgrade a certificate. Especially for those who didn't go through any sort of Cadet Program or chose to delay upgrading their certificates. Creating a perfect recipe for Shipping Companies to apply to the government to allow Foreign STCW 2010 Certified Crews to fill vacant positions.

Revolver
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Re: STCW10 (Manila Convention) comes into force Jan 1 2017

Postby Revolver » Sun May 28, 2017 4:37 pm

Sea Rover wrote:Any Kid who started a Cadet Program in 2009, and graduated in 2013 (for example) and has 36 months of sea time as 4th, 3rd and or 2nd (you don't have to go through the ranks any more) is entitled to the highest license there is. They don't even have to do any TC exams other than 4th's (if they still do 4th's exams)


I'm one of those kids! Haha
I figured having my 2nds would have put me in a safe spot. I did the exams and the orals, and it was a piece of cake - but at least I did go through the exams and prove my understanding of engineering and engine room operations to a particular level. Now they'll just be able to walk in; "yup, I have this that n the other thing" thanks for the next ticket.
That seems dangerous to me...
Though; if someone isn't ready to be 2nd/Chief you would think they'd know and wait to move up, that's the rational thing to do.


If you didn't go to school after 08 then you have to proove/do engineering theory courses at management level, and have the other certs and sea time. Sounds fair to me to a standards of training req.
Sounds impossibly difficult to arrange that all in real life though with the block courses.


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